Episode 19

Becoming a Market Master

Published on: 9th May, 2024

Stephanie welcomes the Strongest Man in Kansas, and Partner with ThinkingAhead, JW Heflin, who lays out the benefits of being highly specialized, how to gain speed to market and great coverage, the mindset for turning around your down years, how to build 4 mega-valuable relationships off of a single piece of info, the importance of NOT throwing spaghetti at the wall, and... what keeps him from eating live young?

Discover what sets ThinkingAhead apart, hear stories from recruiters, and browse opportunities by clicking here.

Transcript
Stephanie Maas:

Welcome to The Talent Trade. I am Stephanie

Stephanie Maas:

Maas, Partner with ThinkingAhead Executive Search. Today I am

Stephanie Maas:

super excited for our listeners. I'm going to be talking with JW

Stephanie Maas:

Heflin. He is also a partner here with ThinkingAhead and a JW

Stephanie Maas:

and I have worked together for years. A few things that he may

Stephanie Maas:

not share that I think I probably should. J W's spirit

Stephanie Maas:

animal is the polar bear. JW also, at one point in time

Stephanie Maas:

recently was the strongest man in Kansas, which always brings

Stephanie Maas:

me a lot of comfort knowing that if we are ever in a situation,

Stephanie Maas:

and I have over indulged and need to be carried out that as

Stephanie Maas:

long as I am with JW that can happen in a safe way. So JW,

Stephanie Maas:

welcome to The Talent Trade.

JW Heflin:

Thanks, Stephanie. Thanks for having me. So yes, my

JW Heflin:

spirit animal is the polar bear, I think it's because I'm cute

JW Heflin:

and cuddly. Maybe if you get me mad, I can get pretty ferocious.

JW Heflin:

It is because I am hot natured. And I like cold weather over hot

JW Heflin:

weather mostly. And yeah, I was strong once. Once.

Stephanie Maas:

As interesting as those fun facts are. We're

Stephanie Maas:

really here to talk about the tremendous success you've had

Stephanie Maas:

with ThinkingAhead, sharing your counsel and wisdom with our

Stephanie Maas:

listeners. So before we dive into the wisdom side of things,

Stephanie Maas:

just share with us a little bit of your background.

JW Heflin:

Absolutely. It's not always rainbows and sunshine,

JW Heflin:

I've had my my bumps and bruises along the way, was hired in

JW Heflin:

November of 2015 Enjoyed it every step of the way. My first

JW Heflin:

year, was a good success that following January, earned

JW Heflin:

partner status with the company through my billings in my

JW Heflin:

production next year, increased my production than the year

JW Heflin:

after that it dropped in the year after that was the worst

JW Heflin:

year ever. So I've had my licks and bumps and bruises, basically

JW Heflin:

paid for an education in executive search that year. By

JW Heflin:

no means do I know everything. There's so much to still learn

JW Heflin:

and master and finesse in this business. And I think that's

JW Heflin:

truly what keeps me so engaged and enjoying what we do on a day

JW Heflin:

to day basis, because there's still so much to get good at.

Stephanie Maas:

So one of the things that I have noticed you

Stephanie Maas:

do particularly well is you are really a master of your niche.

Stephanie Maas:

So share with our listeners a little bit about your niche. And

Stephanie Maas:

I noticed gonna let you talk for quite a while. But the whole

Stephanie Maas:

thought process about being highly specialized, how have you

Stephanie Maas:

become specialized? What are the advantages? Walk us through

Stephanie Maas:

everything that being a market master entails? From your

Stephanie Maas:

perspective?

JW Heflin:

Great question. And I had to become a market master

JW Heflin:

because I didn't even know what my market was. When I started

JW Heflin:

when thinking I had hired me. They said, Hey, we kind of have

JW Heflin:

two areas you could focus on, you could cover commercial

JW Heflin:

banking, commercial lending in the Midwest, and I go, I think I

JW Heflin:

kind of know what that is. Or you could do this thing called

JW Heflin:

equipment, financing, leasing, and cover a national footprint.

JW Heflin:

And I go, I don't know what that is. But that sounds interesting.

JW Heflin:

Let's do that. And I go, what's equipment, finance and leasing?

JW Heflin:

You know, even to this day, I still don't know that I truly

JW Heflin:

know what it is. But But joking aside, that is the industry that

JW Heflin:

I focus in is equipment, finance, and leasing. And

JW Heflin:

recently that's expanded into more of the specialty finance

JW Heflin:

and specialty lending in the financial services world. So

JW Heflin:

you're talking project finance, sponsor, finance, structure,

JW Heflin:

finance, a lot of things that have finance after him is what

JW Heflin:

we do with it. And there's all nuances to it. In a nutshell,

JW Heflin:

it's specialty lending.

Stephanie Maas:

So tell us about this idea of being a market

Stephanie Maas:

master.

JW Heflin:

So the idea of being a market Master is just really

JW Heflin:

owning and knowing your space and being really good in that

JW Heflin:

arena. It does a few things. As a recruiter, it helps you build

JW Heflin:

confidence so that you know what you're doing. Also, as a

JW Heflin:

recruiter, and as a consultant in the space, it adds

JW Heflin:

credibility to what you're doing. Because when you're

JW Heflin:

having conversations with presidents, with Chief Learning

JW Heflin:

officers with managing directors that run multibillion dollar

JW Heflin:

platforms, and you don't have a clue what they're doing, your

JW Heflin:

credibility is nil. So the likelihood of them engaging you

JW Heflin:

to work and help them fill positions is going to be very

JW Heflin:

limited. Now look, we all have to start somewhere and we all

JW Heflin:

have to learn our markets and and learn our niches and through

JW Heflin:

that we become experts. That is where as a market master you

JW Heflin:

become very skillful and very good with what you do. So when

JW Heflin:

you have a client that calls you and says, Hey, we need a credit,

JW Heflin:

underwriter in equipment, finance, we have really

JW Heflin:

exhausted all of our efforts, we think we've interviewed 85

JW Heflin:

people, and we don't have anything. When you're a market

JW Heflin:

Master, you can make three phone calls. And those three phone

JW Heflin:

calls turn into two finalist candidates. And one of them gets

JW Heflin:

hired in a matter of two weeks, where they've spent a few months

JW Heflin:

trying to find the right person. But that doesn't happen

JW Heflin:

overnight. You got to build into that. So how do you build into

JW Heflin:

it? Well, the easiest way get on the phone and talk to people.

JW Heflin:

That is the simplest and easiest way to become a market master is

JW Heflin:

the type of people that you want to place in your industry, just

JW Heflin:

start talking to everyone build those relationships with those

JW Heflin:

people. Part of what we do is somewhat transactional. Because

JW Heflin:

we're matchmakers, we're we're trying to make plug and play

JW Heflin:

people with clients. And so we're trying to find that

JW Heflin:

perfect candidate, that's a perfect fit for that clients

JW Heflin:

that fills their need. Well, sometimes it's super simple,

JW Heflin:

sometimes it's a little bit tougher. And the only way to

JW Heflin:

figure out really what your client's needs are in which

JW Heflin:

candidates fit that is to truly know your market. So you got to

JW Heflin:

know the different positions that are in your space. And the

JW Heflin:

easiest way to do that is start talking and profiling and having

JW Heflin:

conversations with all of those candidates in those different

JW Heflin:

positions.

Stephanie Maas:

So put some legs under that table just for a

Stephanie Maas:

second, especially for some of the folks that might be newer in

Stephanie Maas:

the business, what do those conversations sound like?

JW Heflin:

So the conversations are really just diving into

JW Heflin:

profiling candidates, you know, the first question you're asking

JW Heflin:

them in terms of building rapport is just understanding

JW Heflin:

where they're at from a career standpoint, you know, are they

JW Heflin:

open to making a move, they could either be actively

JW Heflin:

looking, they could be passive, they could be super happy with

JW Heflin:

where they are currently at. But everyone, even if they're super

JW Heflin:

happy, there is just so much change in our world, not just

JW Heflin:

financial services and equipment, finance, I'm talking

JW Heflin:

about the job market as a whole. There's so many variables that

JW Heflin:

go into it, elections, politics, the job market, the economy,

JW Heflin:

there's so many fluctuations that it would be ignorant of

JW Heflin:

someone to not at least be wise of what's going on in the

JW Heflin:

marketplace, they can be completely contented and happy.

JW Heflin:

That's perfectly fine. But they also need to know what's going

JW Heflin:

on in the marketplace, because the music does stop at times

JW Heflin:

whether they want it to or not. And so just find out, are they

JW Heflin:

open to making a move, then from there, dive into that? Hey, what

JW Heflin:

would make sense for you? What are you doing now is that

JW Heflin:

opportunity available with where you're at. And you just start to

JW Heflin:

understand what type of positions and what type of roles

JW Heflin:

they're looking for. And then through that conversation, you

JW Heflin:

can have a follow up conversation where you dive

JW Heflin:

deeper into a lot of those details with it. Hey, tell me

JW Heflin:

more about what it is exactly that you do in your position?

JW Heflin:

What does success look like in your role, you know, as you

JW Heflin:

compare yourself to the other people that you compete with,

JW Heflin:

it's in the same title, same position, what makes you stand

JW Heflin:

out, you know, what makes you rise to the top of your field?

JW Heflin:

And what you do? And through those conversations, and through

JW Heflin:

asking good questions, you start to understand the nuances and

JW Heflin:

all the tangibles of those positions, by having a lot of

JW Heflin:

conversations, not just talking to one or two people, but I'm

JW Heflin:

talking, having multiple, multiple, multiple

JW Heflin:

conversations, you start to figure out who's a really good

JW Heflin:

producer, who's really great at their job, versus people who are

JW Heflin:

very average at their job. And you start to understand why

JW Heflin:

certain people do make the jumps that they make, and why their

JW Heflin:

resumes may show that they've hopped around quite a bit. That

JW Heflin:

just comes from multiple conversations, you can't read it

JW Heflin:

on the internet, you can't really learn it just from

JW Heflin:

listening to other people, you have to go experience and

JW Heflin:

understand that for yourself. You got to do the work.

Stephanie Maas:

So then you're on the phone all day having

Stephanie Maas:

these conversations, learning about your niche. And then to

Stephanie Maas:

your previous point when a client does call and need

Stephanie Maas:

somebody you know who to go after?

JW Heflin:

Absolutely. It allows you to have speed to the

JW Heflin:

marketplace. You know, a perfect example of this is recently

JW Heflin:

we've been talking and having these conversations that I'm

JW Heflin:

talking about the profile calls with candidates in a specific

JW Heflin:

position within my industry. We didn't have anything that we

JW Heflin:

were actively working on. So it was just a very conversation to

JW Heflin:

learn about what type of roles makes sense for them. The

JW Heflin:

logistics of it. Are they great at what they do? Are they

JW Heflin:

average at what they do? Are they open to making a move and

JW Heflin:

where we kind of left the conversations is hey, when

JW Heflin:

something comes across our desk, that's a great fit. We'll give

JW Heflin:

you a Call, well, we get a phone call from a client of ours that

JW Heflin:

says, hey, we need this position. And we got the call on

JW Heflin:

a Thursday. And we said, okay, give us a minute, we'll see

JW Heflin:

who's available in the marketplace, see who we can find

JW Heflin:

that fits all of the qualifications and criteria that

JW Heflin:

you're looking for. In an ideal candidate, by the following

JW Heflin:

Tuesday, three days later, we had six candidates that are

JW Heflin:

qualified and vetted, to put in front of that client, that speed

JW Heflin:

that's coverage on a search assignment. And the reason it

JW Heflin:

was so fast, and we had such good coverage is timing, met

JW Heflin:

opportunity. With that one, we had already been doing the

JW Heflin:

groundwork of just the daily blocking and tackling of what

JW Heflin:

we're supposed to do, and happen to be calling and talking to a

JW Heflin:

lot of those individuals in that specific position. Boom, we get

JW Heflin:

a phone call, they need those people, we go back, and we find

JW Heflin:

the best ones that we recently talked to, they already told us,

JW Heflin:

Hey, we're open for this opportunity. We matched it up,

JW Heflin:

plug and play fit, boom, we go. We had six submittals right

JW Heflin:

there for the search. And not only that, but you can, you can

JW Heflin:

always figure out how good your candidates are on whether or not

JW Heflin:

your clients can interview him. So they interview one out of the

JW Heflin:

six, you're like, Okay, I'm off the target here, I don't think

JW Heflin:

I'm disconnected. Or I'm not on the same page as my client in

JW Heflin:

terms of what they're looking for, versus what I'm showing. So

JW Heflin:

I need to ask more questions, to clarify and make sure I

JW Heflin:

understand what they're telling me. In this scenario, we went

JW Heflin:

six for six, we presented six candidates, they interviewed all

JW Heflin:

six of them. So that is why you want to be a market Master is it

JW Heflin:

allows you to be fast and quick when you have your clients call

JW Heflin:

you or when you're trying to chase down new business because

JW Heflin:

you have the database, the network of people to call into.

JW Heflin:

And you know what they're looking for.

Stephanie Maas:

And to what you just said, it's not just about

Stephanie Maas:

speed, it's about accuracy. So that perspective definitely

Stephanie Maas:

helps and definitely speaks to the success that you've had. I

Stephanie Maas:

can imagine paying one of your clients after months of trying

Stephanie Maas:

to look on their own through the various means that they have at

Stephanie Maas:

their fingertips, and then they call you and three days later,

Stephanie Maas:

they're six outstanding qualified candidates, it kind of

Stephanie Maas:

makes our fee a moot point at that junction, you're like,

Stephanie Maas:

Yeah, who cares what your fee is we're hemorrhaging. And you're

Stephanie Maas:

showing up with with the surgeon and the sutures and all the

Stephanie Maas:

things that we need. Let me go in a different direction. So

Stephanie Maas:

that certainly helps understand the success you've had you

Stephanie Maas:

mentioned early in the call that you've definitely had some off

Stephanie Maas:

years, walk me through what you attribute that to how your

Stephanie Maas:

market mastery helped pull you out of those down years. Speak

Stephanie Maas:

to that if you would, please.

JW Heflin:

Great question. So a couple of things from what I

JW Heflin:

remember. And again, this was a few years ago. And if I

JW Heflin:

remember, there was just some some wonky, unique situations

JW Heflin:

that I dealt with, with some clients and candidates and just

JW Heflin:

changes in the markets. And you know, the ups and downs of the

JW Heflin:

economy and stuff at that time. But I would say the biggest

JW Heflin:

takeaway is mindset. And that was one of the things that I

JW Heflin:

remember learning that year was two things. One is the this is

JW Heflin:

very much a mental game. I mean, what we do sounds very simple.

JW Heflin:

We just talk to people on the phone all day, we are calling

JW Heflin:

people, we usually have great opportunities. And we're just

JW Heflin:

asking people, hey, does this sound great to you, who doesn't

JW Heflin:

want to hear about a job that could improve their career

JW Heflin:

situation, 95% of people are going to be very open to having

JW Heflin:

that conversation. So we just talked to people. However, you

JW Heflin:

know, if it wasn't for the candidates and clients, this job

JW Heflin:

would be absolutely amazing. Joking aside, we deal with

JW Heflin:

people. And when you're dealing with something that is making a

JW Heflin:

change that is so emotionally involved for individuals like a

JW Heflin:

career change, it is challenging. And so that's where

JW Heflin:

one being a market master helps you be better at your job,

JW Heflin:

because you can help your clients and your candidates do

JW Heflin:

due diligence through the interview process. Now, let me

JW Heflin:

clarify that by saying we're not trying to convince our

JW Heflin:

candidates or clients to accept a position or to hire a certain

JW Heflin:

person. That is not what I do. That is not what we do. Our job

JW Heflin:

is to present opportunities and facilitate the conversations to

JW Heflin:

get their questions answered, and to find the best opportunity

JW Heflin:

for the candidate, but also to find the best candidate for our

JW Heflin:

clients that the market can bear at that time. At the end of the

JW Heflin:

day. It's not our choice. We don't care if they choose our

JW Heflin:

position or if they choose our candidate. Our job is to help

JW Heflin:

them get Get to that yes or no, in a very quick, efficient

JW Heflin:

manner. And so doing that having that market knowledge, you can

JW Heflin:

help both sides do that. You can say, hey, here's what's going on

JW Heflin:

in the market, candidates are being recruited very heavily

JW Heflin:

right now, here's your competitors that are also

JW Heflin:

actively looking for the same type of person. So if you like

JW Heflin:

this individual, and it seems to be a good fit, let's move a

JW Heflin:

little bit quicker, doesn't mean we skip steps. It means hey,

JW Heflin:

let's just try and get more of these steps done fairly quickly.

JW Heflin:

Same thing on the candidate side is if they're looking at other

JW Heflin:

opportunities, talk to him hey, what makes sense? What do you

JW Heflin:

like about that opportunity? Of the ones you're looking at? How

JW Heflin:

would you rank it? Hey, here's what I'm hearing in the market,

JW Heflin:

about this company. So your next conversation, you might want to

JW Heflin:

ask him questions around this. So you know, the full scope. And

JW Heflin:

so it allows you to provide your market knowledge to both sides.

JW Heflin:

So they can ask really good questions to know if it truly is

JW Heflin:

a fit or not. Because how many times have we heard as

JW Heflin:

recruiters from candidates where Hey, why are you looking to

JW Heflin:

move? Oh, well, when I was in the interview process, they said

JW Heflin:

it was this but when I actually started the job, it's completely

JW Heflin:

different from what they told me what the job was. That is why we

JW Heflin:

exist. That is our contribution to this process, is to make sure

JW Heflin:

that both sides clearly understand what each of them are

JW Heflin:

bringing into the situation. So there's no confusion. And so it

JW Heflin:

is a good fit. And when we do that very effectively, that's

JW Heflin:

when we have our candidates that stay for multiple years. In

JW Heflin:

addition, get promoted with the companies, we play some app for

JW Heflin:

someone who in six months, they're already looking for

JW Heflin:

another job, because we're really making sure it's a good

JW Heflin:

fit. Because we listen to what's important to our clients. And we

JW Heflin:

listen to what's important to our candidates. And we put the

JW Heflin:

two together, we're not throwing spaghetti against the wall to

JW Heflin:

see what sticks that gets everyone frustrated.

Stephanie Maas:

And I appreciate you sharing that, because what

Stephanie Maas:

I'm hearing but correct me if I'm wrong, is this idea of this

Stephanie Maas:

market mastery helps you to be successful. But it also helps

Stephanie Maas:

pull you out when I mean, let's face it, there are so many

Stephanie Maas:

uncontrollables in the world of search, and there's very little

Stephanie Maas:

that we can control or on occasion have influence over.

Stephanie Maas:

And either way, the market mastery significantly impacts

Stephanie Maas:

your success level.

JW Heflin:

Absolutely. Another thing, another idea that works

JW Heflin:

in my industry. And I would say that it probably works in most

JW Heflin:

industries. There's a few different websites that publish

JW Heflin:

press releases and publications. So I would assume just from buzz

JW Heflin:

and things that I've heard through conversations that most

JW Heflin:

industries will have some sort of press releases of, hey,

JW Heflin:

here's what's going on in our industry, here's the state of

JW Heflin:

the market. Here's the the movers and shakers, here's the

JW Heflin:

companies that are adding and growing, here's the ones that

JW Heflin:

are pulling back all the successes, because everyone

JW Heflin:

loves the publicity. So as a new recruiter, pay attention to that

JW Heflin:

stuff. And here's how it helps you, you find a press release,

JW Heflin:

and such and such company puts out a press release. And they

JW Heflin:

said, hey, great news. We just expanded our our team. And we

JW Heflin:

added these three people to our organization. And they list the

JW Heflin:

names. They list where they hired those individuals from and

JW Heflin:

kind of their background and history with it. And they're

JW Heflin:

excited to have this basically, they just have the press

JW Heflin:

release. So how does that help us as recruiters? Well, helps us

JW Heflin:

a couple of ways. There's a lot of information that's in there

JW Heflin:

if you're looking at it the right way. And so here's how you

JW Heflin:

need to look at those press releases. What that does is that

JW Heflin:

gives you automatically three phone calls to those candidates

JW Heflin:

that just moved. If you haven't talked to him before, call them

JW Heflin:

congratulate them on the new role that went to. Because what

JW Heflin:

do we just talk about? Sometimes, candidates are told

JW Heflin:

one thing in the interview process, and something's

JW Heflin:

drastically different when they get over there. And if that's

JW Heflin:

the case, who are they going to call first? Probably the person

JW Heflin:

that just most recently called him and said congratulations on

JW Heflin:

your move, because they're top of mind. So there's three phone

JW Heflin:

calls right there that you can build a relationship with, with

JW Heflin:

people in your industry. The fourth phone call is to that

JW Heflin:

client or to that company that maybe isn't a client because you

JW Heflin:

didn't place them there. But maybe you want to make him a

JW Heflin:

client because it's obviously they hire. So congratulate them

JW Heflin:

on hiring those three people. And that opens up the door to

JW Heflin:

ask them questions. Hey, great job on the on getting those

JW Heflin:

those people for those positions. How did you guys do

JW Heflin:

it? Was that people you knew in the network? Was that? Did you

JW Heflin:

guys work with a recruiter on that? You know, how long did it

JW Heflin:

take you? You know you can ask a few questions on that. But

JW Heflin:

again, you start building that relationship with them. But it

JW Heflin:

doesn't stop there. Those three people that just made a move

JW Heflin:

They came from somewhere. So there's potentially three open

JW Heflin:

positions out there in the marketplace with wherever those

JW Heflin:

individuals came from. So those are three more business

JW Heflin:

development calls, you can make that maybe you can stumble into

JW Heflin:

a search assignment where they need help filling that position.

JW Heflin:

And so in one, press release, you end up getting six to seven

JW Heflin:

to eight phone calls out of it, just by reading three names in a

JW Heflin:

company. And that's awesome. That's an overlooked, but Easy

JW Heflin:

Way on how you become a market master. And you build your

JW Heflin:

network. And eventually you get to the place where you have the

JW Heflin:

information before the press release ever comes out. And then

JW Heflin:

the press release is like, oh, yeah, I knew that like two

JW Heflin:

months ago. And that's when you know, you're like, Okay, I know

JW Heflin:

what's going on in my world. And then it's really fun to have

JW Heflin:

conversations with your prospects in your clients,

JW Heflin:

because you're seen as that expert, and they're calling you

JW Heflin:

going, Hey, what are you hearing? This just happened? Or,

JW Heflin:

Hey, someone just announced their retirement? Are you

JW Heflin:

working on that? What's going on? Who's being considered as

JW Heflin:

candidates? And those are fun conversations to have, because

JW Heflin:

you're not just the recruiter that slings resumes. You're the

JW Heflin:

recruiter that's connected with the right individuals in your

JW Heflin:

space. And you know, what's going on in the industry.

Stephanie Maas:

What a difference between a vendor and

Stephanie Maas:

a partner. All right, you ready for a little bit of fun, and

Stephanie Maas:

we'll wrap up?

JW Heflin:

Let's do it.

Stephanie Maas:

All right. Don't spend any time thinking. But do

Stephanie Maas:

you have your Outlook screen open?

JW Heflin:

No.

Stephanie Maas:

Okay, we'll open it real quick.

JW Heflin:

Okay, it's open.

Stephanie Maas:

How many messages do you have in your

Stephanie Maas:

inbox?

JW Heflin:

53,000 total. 2,500 unread.

Stephanie Maas:

Ok so if anybody actually wants to get a hold of

Stephanie Maas:

JW do not email him. All right. Polar bears are known to eat

Stephanie Maas:

thier young, if they get too hungry. What are the top three

Stephanie Maas:

foods that keep you from eating your young?

JW Heflin:

Is that a true fact? You just make that up?

Stephanie Maas:

That's true.

JW Heflin:

I didn't know that about polar bears.

Stephanie Maas:

Yeah, I watched it on National Geographic.

JW Heflin:

And I really hope that's not why I'm a polar bear

JW Heflin:

as a spirit animal, that you guys think I eat my young.

Stephanie Maas:

Not unless there's more children that we

Stephanie Maas:

don't know about.

JW Heflin:

No, no. All right, so my three favorite foods. I

JW Heflin:

would say right now anything that involves a tortilla, that

JW Heflin:

seems to be my go to craving, I can put anything inside of

JW Heflin:

tortilla and make a meal out of it. On top of that. Love

JW Heflin:

barbecue and steak and hot wings. Those are my favorite.

Stephanie Maas:

So you're pretty much a vegetarian, then.

JW Heflin:

Exactly. If it's if it's green, and you put it in

JW Heflin:

front of me, it's gonna stay in front of me.

Stephanie Maas:

Ok, the youth are at risk. Got it. All right.

Stephanie Maas:

Where exactly did you go to college?

JW Heflin:

Oklahoma State.

Stephanie Maas:

And where exactly do you live?

JW Heflin:

I don't know if witness protection allows me to

JW Heflin:

disclose that information. No, I live in Wichita, Kansas.

Stephanie Maas:

Okay. And where did we meet?

JW Heflin:

You and I met at Gainesville, Florida many years

JW Heflin:

ago at a awards banquet for the southwestern company.

Stephanie Maas:

So I just want to clarify, I met you a Florida,

Stephanie Maas:

you went to school in Oklahoma, but you live in Kansas. So it's

Stephanie Maas:

fair to say that it makes sense why I have no idea where you

Stephanie Maas:

live where you went to school or understand the Florida

Stephanie Maas:

connection whatsoever.

JW Heflin:

It wouldn't make sense. Although I believe you're

JW Heflin:

the one who has coined the phrase that good recruiters are

JW Heflin:

good listeners and great recruiters are phenomenal

JW Heflin:

listeners. So I'll let the audience just kind of draw their

JW Heflin:

own conclusions to that.

Stephanie Maas:

Yes, listening and retention are two very

Stephanie Maas:

different things.

JW Heflin:

There you go.

Stephanie Maas:

What do you like most about recruiting?

JW Heflin:

That's tough to kind of sum up, because there's a lot

JW Heflin:

of things that I enjoy with it. I love the flexibility that it

JW Heflin:

provides. I mean, this is truly a job you can do anywhere. And I

JW Heflin:

think when you are when you find success, and you get to that

JW Heflin:

point where you've kind of you've paid your dues,

JW Heflin:

everyone's got to pay their dues, and they come at varying

JW Heflin:

times, you know, sometimes we may have a skyrocket to success

JW Heflin:

with it. But then, like me, you get some years where you really

JW Heflin:

pay your dues, and you're like, Okay, I'm getting the full

JW Heflin:

spectrum of this, when you've paid your dues and get good at

JW Heflin:

recruiting, you're really never ever going to be without a job,

JW Heflin:

you have developed a skill set and a talent that you could take

JW Heflin:

and do anywhere. Just because I recruited an equipment finance

JW Heflin:

doesn't mean I couldn't be successful in a completely

JW Heflin:

different niche. Now, it may take some time to build up to

JW Heflin:

it, but you have the foundation to do it. And if you have the

JW Heflin:

intestinal fortitude and the work ethic, you can be

JW Heflin:

successful in it. It's just going to take a little bit of

JW Heflin:

time and heavy lifting. So I love that because it's job

JW Heflin:

security in a sense. And then there's a lot of flexibility to

JW Heflin:

it. I mean, we are all we do. We're in front of a computer and

JW Heflin:

on a phone that's it, you know, we don't have to travel we don't

JW Heflin:

have to spend And, you know, 5000 miles a month in a car,

JW Heflin:

seeing customers, shaking hands kissing babies, we don't have to

JW Heflin:

fly to a different client every other week. We get to go visit

JW Heflin:

our clients when we want to. We can go to conferences, we can go

JW Heflin:

visit them and do client visits. But that's a bonus. That's not

JW Heflin:

something that we have to do to win business and be successful.

JW Heflin:

So those are just some of the things I like about being a

JW Heflin:

recruiter.

Stephanie Maas:

Well, man, thank you so much for being here. I am

Stephanie Maas:

confident our listeners have enjoyed it as much as I have

Stephanie Maas:

enjoyed hosting with you a lot of incredible nuggets. Thank you

Stephanie Maas:

for sharing with us taking the time putting the thought in, and

Stephanie Maas:

from everybody here at The Talent Trade, JW Heflin, have an

Stephanie Maas:

awesome day.

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About the Podcast

The Talent Trade
Presented by ThinkingAhead Executive Search
The Talent Trade is all about finding the right person, for the right opportunity, at the right time. But how exactly do you do that the "right" way? Executive Search Partner and Top Biller Stephanie Maas shares more than 25 years of experience about what it takes to be a top recruiter in today's "talent trade" market, using ThinkingAhead’s four-prong system focused on recruiting, business development, planning, and managing your mindset. It’s real, honest information about how to build your desk, perfect your niche, and stand out among the crowd in your search career.



Southwestern/Great American, Inc., dba Southwestern Family of Companies, for itself and its related entities and their assigns, reserves and retains all rights to their copyrighted materials and trademarks contained in this podcast.
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